deskthority

Ah, the old "is Topre mechanical" argument. That's why I don't like the term "mechanical" keyboards to describe what we're into. I've even heard people say Model F isn't mechanical because it doesn't have switch contacts. Come on! Capsense is awesome, much better than contacts in every case.

Quality keyboards would be a better name for all this stuff, or something in that vein.

As for slider over dome… it all comes down to the dome, and the switch mechanism. Dome over membrane (pretty much every crappy board from the 1990s until chiclet took over in recent years) is a bad recipe because you have to bottom out. All my most hated keyboards are dome over membrane. But capsense alone won't rescue a crappy dome. It can, however, liberate a good one.

a slider makes all the difference on a dome IMO. as the key itself is not falling onto a dome it has some feel to it and some rigidity.

andrewjoy wrote: usually slider over domes are not 1/2 bad, not something to lust over but passable. Something does not have to be true mechanical to be good , look at Trope.

Hmmm, not quite sure about that. I've been saving a lot of dome with slider keyboards for the last two months or so for a big dome with slider review; some of them are pretty bad - not better or even worse than a standard rubber dome - but others are pretty good, not in need at all of a mechanical component.

Of course, I haven't tried Topre yet; the alleged king of dome with slider systems. The odds of me finding one of them at the recycling centre are extremely poor after all. But the capacitive detection system itself should really affect the keyfeel, I would expect. If it feels great, that really should be because of the quality of the rubber dome and slider systems rather than the flat metal plates underneath, I'd think.

Chyros wrote: If it feels great, that really should be because of the quality of the rubber dome and slider systems rather than the flat metal plates underneath, I'd think.

I have always thought that Topre is just very high quality slider over dome. Some people argue that the spring under the membrane provides a distinctive feel, some say it doesn't.
That THOCK tho.

The spring does nothing. I love Topre, but I can't tell the damn difference when I leave a spring out of a switch on purpose. Well… until I plug it into a computer and that key doesn't fire any more! That's why the springs are there: for capacitative sensing. Without the spring, the dome is invisible to the PCB's sensor pads.

Topre's a handful of things all in one package. Superb domes (that's where the thock and the pleasant bottoming out comes from), excellent caps (better than anything shipping on any other modern board), and crucially: capsense. Topre fires half way through travel, like MX. You don't have to bottom out, and you certainly don't have to pound them home like so many lesser rubber domes. This is what sets Topre apart, and makes it really fly, like "mechs" rather than other domes. You fire and forget. No need to ram it to make sure.

Capsense works great on IBM Model F, but it's quite remarkable how it unleashes the dome with Topre. I won't abide any other rubberdomes, but Topre I really do use a lot!

This NCR model 4950 must have the NMB Hi-Tek, but I don't know what's color and variant is it. Could someone id this?
http://www.recycledgoods.com/ncr-2920-9 ... -4000.html
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-NCR-Comput ... 1599643889

Does anybody know what these two boards may be? Is the key tronic something to consider? I might get it for free...

Free is not to afraid which switch it has. Just bring it and shot the switch to us. We"ll id it later. Don't worry.

Key Tronic will be either overrated rubber dome or foam and foil, almost certainly the former in this case. The scond I'm not sure about.

OK, I can't get the key tronic anyway but I think I'll get the other board in a few days... I'll post some pictures if it doesn't feel like crap to begin with

Anyone seen this before?

ettasian wrote: Anyone seen this before?

It's made by Cherry for sure. Very, very rare. Definitely buy it if you have the chance. It'll almost certainly be worth more than what you'll have to pay for it.

photekq wrote:

ettasian wrote: Anyone seen this before?

It's made by Cherry for sure. Very, very rare. Definitely buy it if you have the chance. It'll almost certainly be worth more than what you'll have to pay for it.

Yep, if I'm lucky it will be around $20 +$5 shipping. Definitely gonna try.

Why Cherry? =o

Because. Definitely Cherry! Please get this.

Chyros wrote: Why Cherry? =o

- Style of the font (looks also like doubleshot)
- shape of the keycaps
- TA logo at the bottom, Triumph Adler gear is often produced by cherry (and old TA stuff is always produced by cherry)

all in all a really nice keyboard, I want it

I think I have also seen that keyboard model before on forums.

And this? If my memory doesn't fail me, there was something about M8 switches and this one.

Ok, that's the last one, I swear.

With what appears to be covered version of cherry M8.

More photos here, so I don't take up much space

ettasian wrote: And this? If my memory doesn't fail me, there was something about M8 switches and this one.

Spoiler:

Hey, that looks like the one from "Linus Visits the Cherry Factory" video! (kb at 8m22s)

msiegel wrote:

ettasian wrote: And this? If my memory doesn't fail me, there was something about M8 switches and this one.

Spoiler:

Hey, that looks like the one from "Linus Visits the Cherry Factory" video! (kb at 8m22s)

Oh my god..
I wonder if they meant first as in first cherry keyboard, or just first with M8 switches.
Either way.. Oh god..
I need it.

Thanks buddy.

msiegel wrote:

ettasian wrote: And this? If my memory doesn't fail me, there was something about M8 switches and this one.

Spoiler:

Hey, that looks like the one from "Linus Visits the Cherry Factory" video! (kb at 8m22s)

Hey, msiegel! I remember you. You mysteriously disappeared from geekhack a few years ago. Nice to see you here. Fascinating video.

ettasian wrote: Oh my god..
I wonder if they meant first as in first cherry keyboard, or just first with M8 switches.

I don't think it's the first Cherry keyboard. It might be the first German-made Cherry keyboard though. Cherry moved from US to Germany in 1979. Here is one of the last US-Made Cherry keyboards, my Cherry Pro from 1979:

Hi Mr_A! It *has* been awhile. Nice to see you and a few other familiar users around here, too.

Ironically related to this video, I'm getting my Cherry keyboards ready to sell off. I need the tactility of metal, haha XD

ettasian, I'm a little disappointed that isn't one of your own boards

No need for dissapoinment. It's on its way here :)and I'm gonna take lots of photos for wiki and everyone

mr_a500 wrote: I don't think it's the first Cherry keyboard. It might be the first German-made Cherry keyboard though. Cherry moved from US to Germany in 1979. Here is one of the last US-Made Cherry keyboards, my Cherry Pro from 1979:

Hey, that's a nice one. What are the switches? I got lately a 84' Cherry board myself, M8 covered variant. Sadly can't really find out for sure what the board itself is named.

And about first Cherry keyboards in Germany, I just found something on the Cherry's site itself:
"The shifting of production to Upper Franconian Bayreuth in 1967 is a milestone in computer history. It was here that the first keyboards in the world were manufactured."
and
"By 1967 CHERRY had manufactured the first keyboard in Germany."

And Bayreuth is in fact a city in Germany. So.. who knows

The switches are M7. You can see more here:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/che ... t9903.html

ettasian wrote:

mr_a500 wrote: And about first Cherry keyboards in Germany, I just found something on the Cherry's site itself:
"The shifting of production to Upper Franconian Bayreuth in 1967 is a milestone in computer history. It was here that the first keyboards in the world were manufactured."

I'd say that's a load of crap. There were plenty of computers keyboards before 1967.

mr_a500 wrote: The switches are M7. You can see more here:
http://deskthority.net/keyboards-f2/che ... t9903.html

ettasian wrote:

mr_a500 wrote: And about first Cherry keyboards in Germany, I just found something on the Cherry's site itself:
"The shifting of production to Upper Franconian Bayreuth in 1967 is a milestone in computer history. It was here that the first keyboards in the world were manufactured."

I'd say that's a load of crap. There were plenty of computers keyboards before 1967.

Can't disagree on that, but hey, it's propably just some poor translation from German

I've never seen any German-made Cherry keyboards made before 1979, but I could be wrong. I'd like to see if anybody can find one.

As for the "first keyboards in the world" in 1967, I know for sure that's not true. Here's a keyboard on the 1964 LINC minicomputer:
(Check out that thickness! Apparently, it's a crap keyboard.)

I've been keeping a list of early terminals (with keyboards):

1963 TEK
1964 Univac Uniscope 300 ("Unimatic")
1964 IBM 2260
196? IBM 2250
1967 Sanders 720 (Micro Switch)
1967 Burroughs Input and Display System (Micro Switch)

ettasian wrote: "The shifting of production to Upper Franconian Bayreuth in 1967 is a milestone in computer history. It was here that the first keyboards in the world were manufactured."...but hey, it's propably just some poor translation from German...I just found something on the Cherry's site itself

Because that's the way cherry would like to have potentail customers believe it. Not a translation problem, that's cherry's PR garbage.

It might be a translation problem, if they meant the following:
"The shifting of production to Upper Franconian Bayreuth in 1967 is a milestone in computer history. It was here that the first keyboards in the world were had been manufactured."
But I doubt they did