deskthority

Per discussion here:

http://deskthority.net/photos-videos-f8 ... t6683.html

Turns out that "super grey" is in fact an old clicky space bar switch. As such, I've renamed it "Cherry MX Click Grey".

My proposition is that we rename:

[wiki]Cherry MX Grey[/wiki] → Cherry MX Tactile Grey
[wiki]Cherry MX Dark Grey[/wiki] → Cherry MX Linear Grey

"Dark" is an incorrect name. MX Dark Grey isn't "dark" grey; it's subtly darker, but you'd have to be familiar with the exact shades to be able to tell from looking at an isolated switch whether it's "grey" or "dark grey".

However, of the three confirmed greys, one is clicky, one is tactile, and one is linear. Those seem more useful names to me.

(There is also the one I called "pale grey", as it's not clear from yabb's photo whether it's clear or grey. I suspect it's actually clear. Once we have a clearer idea about that one, it too needs a better name.)

Heh. I always wondered what they are but never cared enough to search

I have a dark gray linear one, a light grey tactile one and a light gray linear one. They all come from old G80-3000 space bars.

What switch does the light grey linear accompany? I'm guessing Cherry changed the shade of grey, but it's possible that we have an undocumented switch. Are the two linear greys roughly the same force? (There's still the question of whether some MX White switches are the same product as MX Blue, i.e. Cherry changed just the colour.)

The light gray tactile one was on a board with mx clears. The linear one was on a board with either blacks or vintage blacks (can't say).

I desoldered some boards I saved from the trash for the switches

When pressing the two linears against each other it seems like the dark grey switch is a little bit lighter. Could be worn out too, it's really hard to tell.

EDIT: Would it help if I sent you the switches?

If you can't tell from pressing them, you'd be better off sending them to HaaTa for his upcoming Switch Measuring Machine™. I have no way to compare them.

Daniel Beardsmore wrote:If you can't tell from pressing them, you'd be better off sending them to HaaTa for his upcoming Switch Measuring Machine™. I have no way to compare them.

I'm nearly ready to start programming microcontrollers for the various sensors. Once that is done I'll have to mount the sensors (probably the hard part).

For the first version I'll have it manually operated (retrieves force + distance).

The second version (well really just adding onto the first), I'll attach a stepper motor so I can automate collecting lots of test data.

I imagine one of those stress fatigue testing jigs they have on show at IKEA, only smaller and with more science!

A couple of properties I'd like to know include off-axis keystroke characteristics, and whether the speed at which a key is struck affects the force/travel curve in any appreciable way. Then maybe a lube injector for switch maintenance studies…

Naturally, in reality all I've done is press a pair of switches' sliders against eachother and watch how they behave under equal pressure!

I have two linear light grey switches. One is from an Amiga 2000 and one is from a Commodore PC-10 keyboard, both is populated by vintage blacks.

Changing the names to Tactile Grey, Liniear Grey and Clicly Grey is for the better and remove confusion. Additional notes about the color can be written/read under each switch section in the wiki.

With (probably) a lot of money, one get get this instrument designed for gunsmiths to measure force vs. position:

http://triggerscan.com/

Muirium wrote:I imagine one of those stress fatigue testing jigs they have on show at IKEA, only smaller and with more science!

A couple of properties I'd like to know include off-axis keystroke characteristics, and whether the speed at which a key is struck affects the force/travel curve in any appreciable way. Then maybe a lube injector for switch maintenance studies…

Naturally, in reality all I've done is press a pair of switches' sliders against eachother and watch how they behave under equal pressure!

Rather than buy this: MX-110S for $3600

Which doesn't even include the force gauge: DPS-1 for $595



I'm going to use this: Found it used for ~$200

Borrowing OO2's DPS-1R (he got a smoking deal on ebay).

The distance sensor I'll be using is one of the cheap igaging sensors often used for lathes. Quite accurate. I've had to reverse engineer the protocol because it's not actually USB going through the "USB" cable (not even enough wires!).
~$35

I also picked up some surplus medical stepper motors. As of today I think I have enough equipment to reverse engineer the protocol for this (there are some related controller specs to work off fortunately). ~$12 each



I'll release all the designs so people can attempt to make their own. Regardless, the force gauge itself is going to be expensive (and cannot be overloaded, so you have to treat it very nicely). And you have to have the tools to actually attach all the sensors and build the bracketing.

Impressive. Not least all the hacking. It's as if you're up to something unusual…

HaaTa wrote: Borrowing OO2's DPS-1R (he got a smoking deal on ebay).

The distance sensor I'll be using is one of the cheap igaging sensors often used for lathes.

Sorry if the question is dumb, as I haven't used a forge gauge for like 15 years or so: Doesn't the measurement tip shorten/elongate when you apply a force?

Halvar wrote:

HaaTa wrote: Borrowing OO2's DPS-1R (he got a smoking deal on ebay).

The distance sensor I'll be using is one of the cheap igaging sensors often used for lathes.

Sorry if the question is dumb, as I haven't used a forge gauge for like 15 years or so: Doesn't the measurement tip shorten/elongate when you apply a force?

These are digital force gauges and use a load sensor. It doesn't move at all.

Hmm, some real force measurement, instead of just activation force measurement. Now you're talking. Then measure some proper IBM keyboards, instead of those lame random-ass linear 70ties keyboards.

There's a lot of warnings on them about overloading the sensor too. I wonder how sensitive to damage they really are? I was always very paranoid that I'd drop it on the pin and break it.

Where's your funny hat?

002 wrote:There's a lot of warnings on them about overloading the sensor too. I wonder how sensitive to damage they really are? I was always very paranoid that I'd drop it on the pin and break it.

It's likely there's some sort of piezo electric material that if squished too much will not measure the same anymore.
They mention 200% overload capacity in the spec. So for yours OO2, about 1kg.

webwit wrote:Where's your funny hat?

The duck stole it!