Help getting the hang of a Kinesis Advantage

[cvds]

Hello Deskthority,

I have been reading a lot on this site and it seems brimming with bright people that seem to know a lot about keyboards and touch typing (first question: touch typing is when you use all 10 fingers??). In the search of advice I took the plunge and start making my first rather lengthy post.

Since my arms (all parts of it) are starting to get most symptoms of RSI and related terms I decided to get an ergonomic keyboard. After visiting a shop I got myself a kinesis advantage and a handshoe mouse as opposed to a logitech wave and a marble. I like the handshoe mouse it feels way better than any other mouse and forces me to use the arm instead of the wrist.

After typing with the advantage for one day I am indeed experiencing the nice feel of the cherry keys and the cups. I also discovered that I am not a proper 10 finger typer as my pointy fingers are actually sharing keys with eachother This is something I can get used to on the advantage. Also normal typing like chat and text is feeling good and I am gaining accuracy while I go (main point of interest here is my brain not getting used to backspace and space on different thumbs)

However there is a problem, I am a programmer using the eclipse IDE. To start I find that some of the symbols I use a lot in the java language ({} and = for instance) are located to far away, these I can probably remap or get used to. Then there are the shortcuts, I find that the ctrl key is located in a odd location (most likely I need to put at least one on the caps key) but the problem does not stop there, for instance ctrl-other modifier-some key shortcuts I find really hard to hit (ex: ctrl-shift-t for "open type", http://www.allapplabs.com/eclipse/eclipse_shortcuts.htm for a chart). Also text selections like shift-home or ctrl-shift-arrow seem odd to physically hit.

DId anyone experience these issues with the advantage or have some helpful hints about remapping keys ?

[webwit]

If you're using Windows, try autohotkey.

[cvds]

HI Webwit,

Thanks for the reply, I was indeed planning to use autohotkey (for now) since I promised not to reprogram it during the trial period. Its just that I am looking for tips on the actual remapping itself mainly to circumvent the weird gripping positions needed to hit the shortcuts. I will try to do some experiments today while I work with the advantage.

[hoggy]

The advantage takes some getting used to - especially the cursor keys. After about 3 weeks the benefits really start to show (they did for me at least).

You can always reset the keyboard before you give it back...

I'd agree with you on some of the punctuation keys, though.

[cvds]

Main issues at the moment are hitting:

ctrl-alt-left/right arrow
alt-tab
ctrl-shift-plus a different key
alt-shift-plus a different key (even harder than the ctrl variant)

edit: using the shift with the right hand makes it easier

[Findecanor]

I moved all cursor keys to the right side. <left>, <up>, <down>, <right> in a row.
I also remap <Ctrl> to <Caps Lock>, but I do that with all keyboards.
A little while I had the <Alt>/<Alt gr> keys mapped to <End>/<Page Down>, but I changed it back.

[cvds]

Update:

I tried remapping the caps to ctrl over the past day but I found out that my pinky is not able to handle the extra strain of hitting the capslock that often thus I am using the original capslock again. Which is odd since on flat keyboards the pinky is always hitting the caps. Thus still no real solution to the awkward shortcut hitting.

So far it seems that my wrists are happier than before, but that could also be due to the fact that I am only typing at halve speed max. But my shoulders are starting to hurt more since the keyboard is rather high and seems to force my shoulders upward. Tho this is also because I have a crappy chair at work of which I can not adjust the armrests properly. I will try to remove the armrests entirely from the chair tomorrow so I can at least move the chair close enough to the desk and see if that will solve the shoulder problem.

[Minskleip]

In Europe, the employer have to supply ergonomic office equipment. Or something. At IBM they had a team for adjusting the desks.

[sordna]

Touch typing means typing without looking at the keys. Proper touch typing does entail using all 10 fingers, and assigning particular columns of keys to each particular finger.
Regarding key combinations, ALWAYS use both hands. That's what proper touch typing dictates anyway, when typing a capital letter, always use the opposite shift key.
Similarly, for CTRL-a use the right control key, and for CTRL-m use the left control key, etc. It's not what most people are used to, but once you practice it you will discover it is both easier on the hands and also faster, since it's faster to simultaneously use both hands to hit a single key with each, than bending a single hand to press 2 keys at once.

Being a long-time Kinesis user, I do find certain 3-key combos problematic.
CTRL-ALT-xxx is no problem, I can easily hold both keys down with my thumb, and use the opposite hand to hit whatever other key.
However, CTRL-SHIFT-xxx is indeed a bit awkward... I tend to stick to the traditional method: modifiers with one hand, whatever other key with the other. So I hold CTRL-SHIFT with the same hand (unfortunately you have to stretch your hand a bit), and hit the other key with the opposite hand. Same for Alt-Tab, I use the right Alt.

The [] keys they were not a problem for me, I could easily get used to them.
The arrows actually I love, I only swapped up/down to down/up to match JK in vi. I like the arrow keys where they are, they are very fast to use while typing since you don't have to move your hand away from the normal position at all. I even like the independent arrows for games!

Some remapping suggestions: You could map the Delete key an additional Shift. You can also get a footswitch to shift with your foot, I've done it and it's a big relief on the pinky fingers.

[cvds]

@minskleip
In holland the employer is liable for injuries caused due to work, if the empoloyee indicates it. Also the paperwork will be done, the hardest part will be finding a chair they are willing to afford

@sordna
Thanks for the tips on using both hands for hitting the modifiers, I will try to retrain myself in the coming days to use both hands. After al I am learning the proper fingers for each key now as the straight layout is forcing me to.

[Gerk]

This is going to be something that will take some time to get used to as well, still waiting on customs to clear my Kinesis Advantage, but I do PHP all day every day and I've been looking at the layout for all the fun coder keys -- I think my brain is going to take some time to process this part of adapting to it.

[kps]

The arrows actually I love, I only swapped up/down to down/up to match JK in vi.

I've used Kineses and vi for ages… and never noticed that. I wonder how crazy it will drive me to swap them now.

You can also get a footswitch to shift with your foot, I've done it and it's a big relief on the pinky fingers.

I'm not an IDE or Windows user, but it sounds like you could set up the three foot switches as Shift, Control, and Alt, and easily press two at once, either with separate feet or straddling switches, depending on the kind of switch.

[Lanx]

took me 2 dedicated days to get fully used to the kinesis, i don't do programming tho, i did hard wire mod "delete" to "shift" which really saves the pinky now (and the main reason i like the kinesis)