Custom 5X15-key alpha sections. Provide your layout ideas.

bpiphany

10 Jul 2012, 20:40

Making a case would be very simple, look at the Poker. No space to fill allows for a simple boat construction.

But.. On a full size Filco you'd save ~2% on the length, and on a tenkeyless ~1.5%. Doing away with the gap between the function row and alpha section is a bigger percentage. My opinion still is that the gaps fill both practical and aestethic functions. I wouldn't mind losing the function row all together though. I use it extremely sparsely...

sad_destroyer

12 Jul 2012, 21:30

@7bit:
Firstly, thank you for holding a friendly discussion with me about this. I welcome input and I know we're all just searching for the holy grail in mechanical interface form.
Having the 1.5" keys available is awesome, I have incorporated that into another revision of my proposal. I'm basing my changes on ergonomic flaws that I encounter on a line-by-line basis while programming.
The reason for the gap between A and my ESC (formerly Caps Lock) is one that I believe many can appreciate: I often hit the caps lock key while trying to type N A, AND AS result my typing will look somewhat like this. It has been fixed in this version, however if you can see my point, and think it may be a feasible idea, I would gladly have that gap put back in.
The other spaces have been remedied in this version; I am assuming, however, that there is a way to flash/reprogram the controller to behave accept my layout, which even has some unused keys because I despise contorting my pinkies to hold modifiers while typing.
But with regards to my layout being "messy" - the whole keyboard is a mess anyways, and that's what we're striving to fix! :)
Another note about my layout is that a half-key of space could be cut from the right side. This would cause smaller enter and (legacy) backspace keys, decreasing the amount of torque that gets applied when a user hits the extreme side of a key, and in my case it would not sacrifice any keys that i "need". But I understand that the 5x15 is a set standard until otherwise expressed.

So to summarize this layout, it's not different aside from a little remapping (no caps lock) until the bottom two rows.
2: [1][1.25][ 10x1 ][1.25][1.5]
1: [1][1][1][1.25][1][1][ 7x1.25 ]
EDIT: layout numbers were not quite correct...
The coloring serves to separate the actions of different fingers from each other. At the bottom are the thumbs. See how much the pinkies do?
I have other ideas too, but this will do for a start. Is there any way I could obtain the current PCB designs? This is really interesting stuff.

Layout picture:
Image
Last edited by sad_destroyer on 12 Jul 2012, 21:58, edited 1 time in total.

bpiphany

12 Jul 2012, 21:46

The controller will be infinitely re-flashable (actually only guaranteed to 10000 times or so). There are firmwares floating around out there. There is my own for the Phantom and a much more ambitious one for the ErgoDOX. My c-skills are not up to handling that one...

I'm not completely sure I want to share the files for this project, at least not quote yet or this openly. But I have uploaded files for the new unfinished keyboard design tutorial. They model a fully functional keyboard.

The layout options for your shift keys are already planned to be possible. Space bar row ideas is one of the things I was most eager to get more of =)

sad_destroyer

12 Jul 2012, 21:54

That's excellent! So there's a chance of those bottom rows being implemented?
Once I get my hands on the actual keyboard I would love to help develop the firmware code. I have started to look at the current code, but without testing it's hard to say that I can make a significant change.
The design tutorial is a great start to the sharing, thank you!
(Note: just edited the numbers on my bottom row specs. Apparently I can't count today.)

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7bit

12 Jul 2012, 22:23

Just as a hint:
Unless you programm COBOL, it would be sufficient to have some Fn or Front key hit along with Shift to get Shift Lock. No reason to have a dedicated Caps Lock button on a reduced keyboard.

Also: There is no reason to make the layout as normal as possible. It just should fit into the 5x15 frame and switch position should be not too unusual.

In the Round 4 key caps group buy you will find a lot of key caps which will fit on your layout, BTW.

bpiphany

12 Jul 2012, 23:29

There are stepped keys that can be used where Caps Lock usually goes. They probably came to be because they are harder to hit by accident. The PCB will of course support this as well. I accidentally hit Ctrl which I have in Caps Lock's plave when typing an 'a', and hitting Ctrl+A while typing usually deletes the whole text on the next character typed =D

mintberryminuscrunch

13 Jul 2012, 11:56

7bit wrote:This is not radical enough!

Here comes my latest 5x15 design:
can you post one with the bottom row:
1 ; 1.5 ; 1.5 ; 1.5 ; 2 ; 2 ; 1.5 ; 1.5 ; 1.5 ; 1

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7bit

13 Jul 2012, 12:52

Don't know what to put on some of the key caps, but here it is:
Attachments
mintberry_5x15.png
mintberry_5x15.png (18.06 KiB) Viewed 2436 times

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7bit

13 Jul 2012, 12:59

Maybe this looks a bit better:
Attachments
mintberry_5x15a.png
mintberry_5x15a.png (7.97 KiB) Viewed 2434 times

mintberryminuscrunch

13 Jul 2012, 13:06

7bit wrote:Don't know what to put on some of the key caps, but here it is:
That's pretty much it but with a standard enter key, thanks :-)

sad_destroyer

13 Jul 2012, 20:42

I do not program COBOL(haha), but I still never feel the need to use caps lock (not even when typing "COBOL" here). I could potentially use one of the unknown keys for a shift lock modifier, however. I would be willing to program the board's controller to work with this layout too.
I would definitely go for a stepped caps lock key (to be used as Esc).
Can I have a post with the bottom two rows as follows? So that there is a model for actually using the layout.
1 ; 1.25 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1.25 ; 1.5
1 ; 1 ; 1.25 ; 1 ; 1 ; 1.25 ; 1.25 ; 1.25 ; 1.25 ; 1.25 ; 1.25 ; 1.25
Blank keycaps are fine, or you could use my layout Image
Unless you don't feel another workup of this is necessary.
I do want to get some keycaps and switches, but I figure I'll make sure of the board first. Are these boards going to be part of the next Phantom keyboard group buy?

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